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Thread: Is the CVT really more efficient than the manual transmission?

  1. #21
    Senior Member Top_Fuel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IchabodCrane View Post
    Isn't there a thread showing rpm at certain speeds re manual vs cvt here on the forum?
    I had a similar question a few months ago...

    CVT and RPMs


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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 52.2 mpg (US) ... 22.2 km/L ... 4.5 L/100 km ... 62.6 mpg (Imp)


  2. #22
    Business Up Front Johnny Mullet's Avatar
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    CVT eliminates human interaction with proper gearing. The right conditions and the proper intelligent human gearing/throttle input beats the computer every time.

  3. #23
    Senior Member IchabodCrane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Mullet View Post
    CVT eliminates human interaction with proper gearing. The right conditions and the proper intelligent human gearing/throttle input beats the computer every time.
    Actually no, it doesn't eliminate human interaction.
    The cvt can be prodded to upshift, downshift or behave a certain way with driver input. I can make it upshift early to run rpm as low as 1000 and hold it at city speeds. I can cause a "downshift" to jump to 3000rpm from 2000rpm at the bottom of a hill or to pass. I can make it run the ragged edge or keep up with my grandma.
    It seems most of you "purists" think the cvt makes me a rider not a driver but this is far from truth. The cvt simply demands different input to perform well.
    Will weld for beer.

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2014 Mirage SE 1.2 automatic: 45.3 mpg (US) ... 19.3 km/L ... 5.2 L/100 km ... 54.5 mpg (Imp)


  4. The Following User Says Thank You to IchabodCrane For This Useful Post:

    Eggman (01-23-2017)

  5. #24
    Moderator Eggman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IchabodCrane View Post
    Actually no, it doesn't eliminate human interaction.
    I agree with you. I had the same experience driving the dealership loaner Outback - that is, I could keep the engine RPMs low if I was light on the accelerator pedal.

    So, back to the original question: why does the manual transmission get better fuel economy?

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 49.6 mpg (US) ... 21.1 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 59.5 mpg (Imp)


  6. #25
    Senior Member MightyMirageMpg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IchabodCrane View Post
    Isn't there a thread showing rpm at certain speeds re manual vs cvt here on the forum?
    What I meant by my last blurb was you could identify the exact rpm or speed the CVT gained advantage using math. You would need too know a LOT of information though, including injector size and actual volume of fuel dispersed per millisecond, engine RPM and load, and have the end result fuel map displayed in pulse width for both auto and manual cars.

    Then you could simply do the math, and know. But it's ludicrous concept because that's way to much work and there's so much missing info.. plus we aren't building a space shuttle and you'll still end up hours of your life shorter with nothing actual gained except a pretty rad chart.

    The fuel map knows all!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Eggman View Post
    I agree with you. I had the same experience driving the dealership loaner Outback - that is, I could keep the engine RPMs low if I was light on the accelerator pedal.

    So, back to the original question: why does the manual transmission get better fuel economy?
    Read post 18,... or summed up... the drag of the CVT, and its losses.

    For reference, I can spin the mirage transmission in gear (by itself) with one hand. I'm physically capable of dealing with its drag.

    I probably couldn't develop enough energy to make the CVT function even on a row machine.

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    OK so to summarize this thread:
    -Manual gets better economy at city speeds with proper technique
    -CVT gets possibly better economy at very high speeds on the highway

    Am I correct?

  8. #27
    Moderator Eggman's Avatar
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    MightyMirageMpg, doesn't OBDII report engine load percentage? That could be used to compare the two transmissions in a side-by-side comparison. I understand there is some app like Torque that can log data, no? Cheap & easy.

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 49.6 mpg (US) ... 21.1 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 59.5 mpg (Imp)


  9. #28
    Senior Member MightyMirageMpg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eggman View Post
    MightyMirageMpg, doesn't OBDII report engine load percentage? That could be used to compare the two transmissions in a side-by-side comparison. I understand there is some app like Torque that can log data, no? Cheap & easy.
    I Have no idea honestly, I'm out of date in that regard


    Edit: i don't see the output percentage for the fuel injectors. There is quite a bit of inputs and stuff you can monitor tho
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by MightyMirageMpg; 01-23-2017 at 07:21 PM.

  10. #29
    Senior Member Top_Fuel's Avatar
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    One other variable to consider when talking about a CVT and highway fuel economy...

    Does the car have a CVT and cruise control? Read explanation HERE

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 52.2 mpg (US) ... 22.2 km/L ... 4.5 L/100 km ... 62.6 mpg (Imp)


  11. #30
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    I'm definitely looking for a mirage with cruise control.

    Top Fuel and Eggman, since you have manuals, what has been your experience with highway driving? What MPG can you achieve on a flat highway? I know it varies by temperature but just a rough estimate helps



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