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Thread: 6th Gen Mirage: Tuner/Power Programmer/ECU/Piggyback. Where are we now?

  1. #31
    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    Here is a zoom of said ring.

    Name:  crankshaft sensing ring iso x4 zoom.jpg
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    Last edited by Qrush; 11-11-2017 at 03:51 PM.

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    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    I showed the above pics to the Haltech rep. His response, "Looks to be what is called 36-2-1, which is supported". That is good news. I am still trying to locate an accurate pic/diagram of the camshaft trigger wheel. When we get that sorted, we have a shot at a setup.

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    Administrator Daox's Avatar
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    Great leg work Qrush!

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 automatic: 49.0 mpg (US) ... 20.8 km/L ... 4.8 L/100 km ... 58.8 mpg (Imp)


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    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daox View Post
    Great leg work Qrush!
    Im happy were at least making progress. Albeit at a more reserved pace. There are a handful of companies willing to have a dialogue. So there is some hope there. If we can nail down some of these specific questions, getting a tune may be a lot easier and worry free.

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    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    I believe the circled area on the intake camshaft (1015B324) to be the location of the camshaft sensor wheel that the camshaft position sensor (MR985041) reads from

    Name:  overhead view cams.jpg
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    Havent been able to locate a pic/diagram of the wheel itself. Its likely going to take a pic of a live intake camshaft.
    Last edited by Qrush; 11-13-2017 at 07:10 PM.

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    Senior Member Rkt Ship's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qrush View Post
    I believe the circled area on the intake camshaft (1015B324) to be the location of the camshaft sensor wheel that the camshaft position sensor (MR985041) reads from

    Name:  overhead view cams.jpg
Views: 41
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    Havent been able to locate a pic/diagram of the wheel itself. Its likely going to take a pic of a live intake camshaft.
    Name:  15107054662921615597602.jpg
Views: 28
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    Hope this works for you. Let me know if you need anything else

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    Senior Member Rkt Ship's Avatar
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    Name:  15107055484401921720860.jpg
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    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rkt Ship View Post
    Name:  15107055484401921720860.jpg
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    Rkt you are awesome! This is exactly what was needed. Ive sent these to the reps i am in contact with. We should get a positive result from this. Very well done!
    Last edited by Qrush; 11-15-2017 at 12:49 AM.

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    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    Ok, were humming along here. But there are still a few specific questions that must be answered with precision. The following questions are from the DIYAutoTune questionnaire. Yes, a couple of these may seem simplistic, but im a newb and i can screw up a drawn breath .

    3. Is it important to you to run sequential injection, or is bank to bank fueling OK for you? (i tried to get intel on this to no avail)

    6. What type of ignition system does your car run- is there a distributor? Coil pack? Coil on Plug? (would you call our setup a coil on plug or a coil pack?)

    7. What sort of sensor(s) does it use to trigger the ignition? Variable reluctor (magnetic pickup)? Optical? Hall effect? Old fashioned mechanical breaker points? Are the sensors triggered by trigger wheels on the crankshaft / flywheel, distributor / cam, or both? (we managed to sort out that there are 2 sensors that are the same part in different locations on the engine block. what i havent worked out is whether or not they are VR/Optical/Hall Effect. im told they are magnetic pick-ups)

    8. How many teeth / windows / slots and are on the crank or distributor trigger wheel? How are they arranged? (Equally spaced, missing teeth gaps, etc) (this was the one that held us up. but we managed to figure the crank sensor wheel to be a 36-2-1 sensor wheel, which was supported. recently gleaned intel regarding the cam sensor wheel, shall soon bear fruit)

    9. Does this engine have a fast idle valve (IAC)? If so, how many wires are connected to it? Do you know if it is an on/off, pulse width modulated, thermal, or stepper type? (i tried to get intel on this to no avail)

    These are the questions i was not able to button down. They will surely expect some specificity.
    Last edited by Qrush; 11-15-2017 at 01:49 AM.

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    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    3. Is it important to you to run sequential injection, or is bank to bank fueling OK for you?

    This is a post on the Holley forums by administrator, Danny Cabral (https://forums.holley.com/showthread...amp-Paired-EFI). In his opening statement on his post "Sequential EFI vs. Bank-To-Bank & Paired EFI", he gives a simple comparative of the 2 injection methods.

    Bank-to-Bank or Paired EFI injects half the amount of fuel (lb/hr - PW), twice for each combustion cycle (4-stroke engine). Sequential EFI injects the total amount of fuel (lb/hr - PW), once for each combustion cycle (4-stroke engine). So even though the net amount of fuel injected is the same, sequential EFI does it with half as many injector events, by injecting double the amount of lb/hr - pulse width fuel. The total injector duty cycle remains the same (two injector events per cycle with Bank-To-Bank, Paired), but with double the amount of pulse width from sequential injection. The increased injector pulse width is why large injectors can still idle good under sequential control but not under Bank-to-Bank control (or Paired). Different injection method, but essentially the same amount of fuel consumed.

    Sequential injection will always get slightly better fuel economy and cleaner exhaust emissions. Also, according to page 152 of "How to Tune and Modify Engine Management Systems" (book by Jeff Hartman), sequential injection always gains power at peak torque and at peak horsepower. However, for racing applications, the most significant benefits to sequential injection are good idle quality with large injectors (for the reasons in my quote above), improved fuel rail pressure balance (pulses), individual cylinder fuel correction (adjustments), and Injector End Angle tuning (LINK). FYI: Sequential Injection always requires a cam sync sensor/unit.

    Another benefit of sequential EFI, is the capability to phase the injector timing, during the intake stroke for best efficiency. Also, since sequential EFI only injects once per cycle, the injector dead time is not doubled (like it is with non-sequential injection, which results in decreased fuel flow and sometimes requires a larger injector to compensate).
    Read "Injection Timing", "Injector Dead Time" & "Individual Cylinder Trim":
    http://www.motec.com/filedownload.ph...pdf?docid=2490 (Motec Glossary, page 70.)
    http://www.tracklab.biz/html/motec_terms.html (← Or read the same document here.)

    An individual runner intake manifold (multiple throttle bodies) is the one application where sequential injection has the least amount of benefits (power-wise), because the individual runner design gets it's own (isolated) air & fuel supply for each cylinder.

    Holley's Untimed Sequential injection strategy still injects once per revolution, but without a cam sync sensor. It still injects fuel in accordance to the engine's firing order (programmed into EFI software), however, without a cam sync sensor, it can't identify #1 cylinder. Holley's Untimed Sequential injection (like full sequential) also has the benefit of good idle quality with large injectors and improved fuel rail pressure balance (pulses); even though it doesn't inject in sequence with each cylinder's intake valve opening.

    Seems as if sequential efi is the way to go?



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