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Thread: 6th Gen Mirage: Tuner/Power Programmer/ECU/Piggyback. Where are we now?

  1. #81
    Moderator Eggman's Avatar
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    Good posts, satria wr. Do you have any online links to the products you refer to? That way we can read more about it to catch up with you.


        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 50.1 mpg (US) ... 21.3 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 60.1 mpg (Imp)


  2. #82
    Senior Member satria_wr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eggman View Post
    Good posts, satria wr. Do you have any online links to the products you refer to? That way we can read more about it to catch up with you.
    Best place to buy pcmflash is ecutools.eu
    For openport, just go to tactrix.com
    Winols, evc.de



    PS: Mitsubishi is indeed not dead. 4N15 is still the first mivec diesel engine from japanese manufacturer.
    2013 Honda Vario CBS VB
    2014 Mitsubishi Mirage CVT EGM
    2015 Toyota Innova 2.5V AT SMM
    2013 Proton Preve CFE CVT PW
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    2016 Mitsubishi Pajero Sport Dakar AT TGM Limited

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2014 Mirage Exceed 1.2 automatic: 39.0 mpg (US) ... 16.6 km/L ... 6.0 L/100 km ... 46.8 mpg (Imp)


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  4. #83
    Moderator Eggman's Avatar
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    Anyone have any updates on this effort?

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 50.1 mpg (US) ... 21.3 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 60.1 mpg (Imp)


  5. #84
    Still Plays With Cars Loren's Avatar
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    Wow, this is a deep thread!

    I hate to be the bearer of bad news or discouragement in the face of such a fine group effort of detective work, but a couple things:

    First, we really should be able to tune this engine to do anything we want with the factory ECU. It's been proven "flashable". All you need is the right cable, the right software and the know-how. I've not done this yet, but I plan to pursue it. It's almost silly not to use the factory systems that are already in place.

    Second, I *have* done several Megasquirt installations and tuned several MS cars. It's really NOT a beginner level thing. I would recommend to no one (not even myself, and I have experience) that they try to cobble a MS (not even the latest, greatest MS3x) ECU to this car. Can it handle it? Sure. Is it a big ol' giant can of worms that will make you hate life? Oh, hell yes.

    If you want to play with custom ECU installation and tuning, don't start with a high-tech modern car, especially not one that you need to drive. Start with something simple. You can Megasquirt anything. Literally anything. Buy an old beater $500 Toyota Corolla or something. It doesn't even have to be drivable or registered or insured, it just needs a running engine that you can play with. Preferably something that's already fuel injected, as that's easier. Basic early-mid-90's EFI. Simple stuff. Get your feet wet, learn about all of this stuff that dear Matt is talking about. Crankshaft position, camshaft position, all of the other required basic inputs. (there really aren't many)

    Get something SIMPLE running with MS. Then you'll start figuring out what a hassle it is to get good idle control at all engine temperatures in all conditions, good start-up with any ambient temperature with any engine temperature, good acceleration response at any RPM and load, etc, etc. You're opening Pandora's box, people!

    If you stick with the stock ECU, you can leave a lot of things like idle control alone. Or just make minor tweaks to them. You don't have to start from scratch and test and tune and retest and tune some more, EVERY. SINGLE. PARAMETER.

    Megasquirt is a blessing and curse. If you're lucky enough to have a car that DIY has a "plug & play" kit for, and especially if somebody else can provide you with a good base tune that they've already worked a lot of the bugs out of... things can be easier. But, you still either end up putting up with a lot of finicky behavior (anybody remember the days of carburetted cars?), or a neverending process of tuning stuff. "Oh, yeah, it floods when you try to start it if the temp is below 40 degrees. It's only been below 40 degrees once this year so far, so I haven't been able to tune it." (and then... you only get ONE, perhaps TWO shots at a truly cold start in a day... ugh...) Or "warm starts are a *****, too... hot starts are fine, cold starts are fine, but if the coolant is like 120 degrees, it won't start... I haven't been able to figure out why"... or my favorite, "it's fine at cruise, but it goes lean/rich/stumbly when you tip into the throttle, I just can't get the acceleration enrichments right"... it's always something. Always.

    It's not for the faint of heart. It's not easy. It's a MAJOR commitment.

    My first MS install was on a 1976 Triumph Spitfire, a car originally designed in about 1962, based on a sedan from the 50's... very low tech. I first set the MS up to just control ignition with a Ford EDIS unit from an Escort... which was a pretty remarkable upgrade in itself. (instant starting, and VERY much smoother running) Then, I installed a simple single-injector throttle body unit in place of the carb. And it was amazing! (more power and smoother power delivery once I got it tuned right) From distributor and points ignition and a crappy old carb to modern computer-controlled ignition and injection. Night and day! And it was all a very simple bolt-on installation. I had to make a few parts, but I didn't have to open the engine or anything. That was a MS2 without a lot of bells and whistles. Just basic single-point fuel injection. Kinda glad I started with that, it was a good learning experience.

    After that, I did a couple MS on Miatas, and I've helped friends tune their MS Miatas. It's kinda fun once you wrap your head around it. We did MS2, MS3, MS3x, PnP, Microsquirt, you name it. And we did standard OE hardware with batch injection, conversion to sequential injection, conversion to sequential ignition with coil on plug, turbo and superchargers. You can do just about anything with a Megasquirt!

    But, again I tell you... you DON'T want to try to start with a completely custom complex installation like this. You're miles over your head. Start with something simpler. Something that is a non-critical "project" that you can just play with.

    Sorry for the ramble. I'd have chimed in sooner, but I wasn't here.

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  7. #85
    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    A few months back I contacted John Estrada w/JestrTuning.com. We worked towards an ecu reflash. I ran some data logs for him and he gave me a rom to try. Long story short, we had a checksum value error during writing and a "brick" for my troubles. This was a real fail and caused me a lot of hassle. I was so angered and deflated from the xperience, that I dropped the operation. Without completely flaming Jestr, ill just say hes not a great communicator. At the same time, I shouldve asked more questions. Its a learning experience, although costly.

    Jestr contacted me a few weeks ago asking if i could open the "bricked" ecu. He said he wanted to see if he could "bench" it and perhaps flash a rom. I told him I would just mail it to him, which I did and he just received. I harbor no hopes of progress, unless he suddenly opens up and carries on an informative dialogue.

    However, there are others as some have mentioned. Orangevirus Tuning comes to mind. I have had previous conversations with Orangevirus Tuning, but no further development has come to my attention. I will re-establish comms with them and see where it goes.

    I have also done a fair amount of research on the Unichip Q/Q+/Q4 piggyback system, which has been installed on quite a few Mirage overseas. Its seems legit and has similar capabilities to a standalone ecu. Costly though: unit itself, installation and dyno time - are all mandatory.

    Perhaps with the help of our new forum member Loren, we can see about a path or two.

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  9. #86
    Administrator Daox's Avatar
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    One of our other members bricked his ECU too, but he was able to get it back. He didn't go into details though.
    Custom Mirage products: Cruise control kit, Glove box light, MAF sensor housing
    Current project: Developing a rear sway bar alternative

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 41.7 mpg (US) ... 17.7 km/L ... 5.6 L/100 km ... 50.0 mpg (Imp)


  10. #87
    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    I have been having a continuing back-and-forth with Matt Cruz from AEM electronics about our platform. Managed to get a definitive crank trigger wheel pic...
    Name:  crank trigger1.jpg
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    Heres the response:
    "A 36-2-1-1 crank trigger pattern is not supported by the Infinity units. You will need to switch to an aftermarket crank trigger pattern".

    Seen the Megasquirt DIY on mounting an aftermarket trigger wheel. Still requires 3A92-specific, custom fabrication of a mount for the sensor. Lots of work!
    Last edited by Qrush; 06-30-2018 at 05:11 AM.

  11. #88
    Still Plays With Cars Loren's Avatar
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    It's really not that big of a deal. If you're installing and tuning a custom ECU, it's a big job. The crank trigger is just a small part of it.

    Look at the thread that's going on about lightweight pulleys. You could have a custom pulley made that would incorporate teeth, mount a sensor to read those teeth, and you're done. Any shop that's already CNC milling a pulley for you could easily incorporate very accurately milled teeth into what they were doing.

    There are a thousand ways you could do this. When I did it the first time, it was on a 1976 Triumph Spitfire. I took the stock cast-iron crankshaft pulley, found a 36-tooth motorcycle sprocket, filed one tooth off of the sprocket, and then had a friend weld the sprocket onto the pulley. It wasn't particularly pretty, but it worked.

    The Mirage stock crank pulley is a similar chunk of cast iron. You could easily do the same trick. 36-1 is a pretty standard crank wheel arrangement. Easy to do. Here's a neat page with some examples and discussion:
    https://wiki.autosportlabs.com/Trigger_Wheel_Designs

    Or, if you wanted to take apart the engine, you could just modify the stock trigger wheel. Weld a few teeth into the missing places and make it a 36-1 wheel. Then you could use the stock sensor in the stock location, which would be kinda cool.

    I still think figuring out how to retune the stock ECU would be a lot easier than any aftermarket ECU in the long run. The Evo guys do it. No reason we can't do it.
    Simplify and add lightness.

  12. #89
    Member Qrush's Avatar
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    Very interesting angle and article about the tooth fabrication on the crank pulley, which i had not seen. I will query NST about the pattern and fabrication possibilities, once they get the pulleys.

    Having neither the tools or the know-how to fabricate a mount, i would have to find another way.

    I just sent another post to OrangeVirusTuning to try and see if they ever want to try a remap. With them, i believe its more of a "worth-the-effort" thing, as i doubt its often anyone inquires about their Mirage they want a few maps for.
    Last edited by Qrush; 06-30-2018 at 05:13 AM.

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    I've got my mirage turbo running with an aem fic6 piggy back and only get a code for "02 sensor bank 1 too rich" probably due to running a 200 cel catalytic converter. I haven't finalised the tune but have it running with safe afr's and getting about 400km to a tank if I stay out of boost. car is currently 1800km away from me but when I get it out here I am going to get it dyno'd and work on getting the required data to give to haltech as I'd like to run an elite standalone ecu down the track for launch control and boost by gear type stuff.



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