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Thread: Alternator delete with regen braking modification for better MPG

  1. #131
    Administrator Daox's Avatar
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    Nope, I haven't looked into clutches at all. Sounds pricey. I wish I had a small lathe or mill to make little specialty parts. Alas no. Unless it can be 3d printed or welded up simply enough, I shy away from it.


    Custom Mirage products: Cruise control kit, Glove box light, MAF sensor housing, Rear sway bar, Upper grill block

    Current project: DIY Nitrous oxide setup for ~$100

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 47.2 mpg (US) ... 20.1 km/L ... 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.7 mpg (Imp)


  2. #132
    Moderator Eggman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fummins View Post
    Slightly off topic, but have you considered trying to see if any one way clutches would fit the Mirage alternator? They've been around for a while and there might be something that'd fit. Wouldn't be able to get any kind of regen braking if you did though.
    How would a one-way clutch provide any benefit? The alternator converts mechanical energy to electrical energy and not the other way around. That, and engine rotation doesn't reverse direction. Usually.

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 49.6 mpg (US) ... 21.1 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 59.5 mpg (Imp)


  3. #133
    Moderator Eggman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daox View Post
    Alright, lets get back to this project. Last I left it, I had fried my dc-dc converter. It can only handle 18V for 100ms, and is really only meant to handle 13.2V which is kind of low. When the alternator kicks on, it boots the voltage up to 14.4V. When you switch it back to the dc-dc converter, that is simply too high and it will eventually fry as mine did. This simply won't work for the next phase of this project. So, we have to revisit the design and make things a bit more robust.

    This is what we started with:





    This is what we're now going to. I've added a 7805 linear voltage regulator before the dc-dc converter. This linear voltage regulator will take 7-35V and convert it down to a regulated 5V. So, a voltage spike of 14.4V is nothing for this puppy to handle. It then spits out 5V to the new dc-dc convter which converts 5V to 15V. The old one took 12V and converted to 15V. This design will be a lot more robust and should really never have issues with frying components, yay!

    Attachment 13059
    Have you looked into this design?

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 49.6 mpg (US) ... 21.1 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 59.5 mpg (Imp)


  4. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by Eggman View Post
    How would a one-way clutch provide any benefit? The alternator converts mechanical energy to electrical energy and not the other way around. That, and engine rotation doesn't reverse direction. Usually.
    I suck at explaining things but I'll kinda try. At least the way I understand it?
    If you hit the gas then let off and coast the engine will slow down, if you have a decoupler or one way clutch on the alternator pulley the alternator will keep spinning for a little while causing slightly less drag/load. There's a bit more rotating mass in an alternator compared to something like a water pump. Basically with a clutch it'll drag the engine down slightly less at under certain circumstances.

    Someone more smarterer could probably explain betterer

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2014 Mirage SE wussie cvt edition. 1.2 automatic: 37.7 mpg (US) ... 16.0 km/L ... 6.2 L/100 km ... 45.3 mpg (Imp)


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  6. #135
    Senior Member Mitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daox View Post
    ...
    This is what we're now going to. I've added a 7805 linear voltage regulator before the dc-dc converter. This linear voltage regulator will take 7-35V and convert it down to a regulated 5V. So, a voltage spike of 14.4V is nothing for this puppy to handle. It then spits out 5V to the new dc-dc convter which converts 5V to 15V. The old one took 12V and converted to 15V. This design will be a lot more robust and should really never have issues with frying components, yay!

    Attachment 13059
    Sometime I will hookup a scope into the FR line to check if my suspicion is correct, the trigger voltage is pulsed DC controlling the duty cycle of the field coil.

    I am toying up with the idea that instead of cutting off the C-225 wire, just reduce the duty cycle by inserting instead a variable duty cycle DC supply, so you don't have to put a charger at home.

  7. #136
    Moderator Eggman's Avatar
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    Watch out for cooking the battery by overcharging - too much charge current in too little time. Lead acid batteries can only take so much. That's why they have vents.

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 49.6 mpg (US) ... 21.1 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 59.5 mpg (Imp)


  8. #137
    Senior Member stevedmc's Avatar
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    It’s 37°F in Baton Rouge this morning. I sure am glad I have a full size battery and a working alternator.

  9. #138
    Still Plays With Cars Loren's Avatar
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    Steve, and anyone else who feels the need to make such comments, please consider:

    "Am I adding anything useful to this conversation?"

    The pros and cons have already been discussed. If YOU have no desire to participate in the experimenation that's going on, that's perfectly fine. We don't need your snide remarks and psuedo-comedy cluttering up a good thread.

    Think of the people who are going to come in and read this and learn from it in the future. You are making this story much more cumbersome for a person to read.
    Simplify and add lightness.

  10. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Loren For This Useful Post:

    Alpha_One (11-15-2018),Fummins (11-15-2018),HitShane (11-24-2018),MetroMPG (11-15-2018),mohammad (06-01-2021),Pryme (11-15-2018),TcoloT (08-12-2023)

  11. #139
    “Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

    ― Mark Twain

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2014 Mirage SE wussie cvt edition. 1.2 automatic: 37.7 mpg (US) ... 16.0 km/L ... 6.2 L/100 km ... 45.3 mpg (Imp)


  12. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Fummins For This Useful Post:

    Pryme (11-15-2018),stevedmc (11-15-2018)

  13. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fummins View Post
    “Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

    ― Mark Twain
    This one also applies nicely...

    "It's better to keep your mouth closed and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt!!"



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