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Thread: Alternator delete with regen braking modification for better MPG

  1. #191
    Just A Mirage!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daox View Post
    This may be the eventually way I go. That opens up a lot of possibilities for other fun mods...
    Arduinos are great for when you need a lightweight device that lives on the CANBUS permanently (say, to drive a little 1" OLED display for showing a custom gauge/data). For exploring/debugging projects, I find my RaspberryPi with the PiCAN shield and a 7" display is far more useful since you get a full linux desktop with OBD and network access built in. Just my $0.02, I've been down that road


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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2017 Mirage GT 1.2 automatic: 37.5 mpg (US) ... 15.9 km/L ... 6.3 L/100 km ... 45.0 mpg (Imp)


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    Daox (09-06-2019),Loren (09-06-2019)

  3. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by phaux View Post
    For exploring/debugging projects, I find my RaspberryPi with the PiCAN shield and a 7" display is far more useful since you get a full linux desktop with OBD and network access built in. Just my $0.02, I've been down that road
    It would be cool if it could do TPMS.

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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 49.7 mpg (US) ... 21.1 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 59.7 mpg (Imp)


  4. #193
    Administrator Daox's Avatar
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    I've been looking around and I found another gauge that I am going to pick up instead of the one I have. It doesn't have as many gauges, but I think it will work a lot better. It specifically says that it measures current in both directions and adds and subtracts from Ah used.

    DROK DC 0-300V 200A STN LCD Display Digital Multimeter Voltage Ampere Power Energy Ammeter Voltmeter Battery Volt Amp Meter AH Monitor Panel with Hall Sensor



    Custom Mirage products: Cruise control kit, Glove box light, MAF sensor housing, Rear sway bar, Upper grill block

    Current project: DIY Nitrous oxide setup for ~$100

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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 47.2 mpg (US) ... 20.1 km/L ... 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.7 mpg (Imp)


  5. #194
    Moderator Eggman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daox View Post
    Yep, my trips are almost all above 60 mpg. My last tank was the best yet, and I did the mod partway through it.

    Hey Daox, about when (as in where in your chart) do you think you changed the oil in your transmission?

    Found it. Dated 3-Jun-2019
    Quote Originally Posted by Daox View Post




    Alright, yesterday was the day. I put the MT-LV in the Mirage. This new transmission oil is definitely thinner than the OE spec fluid. My engine was still a bit warm, and the oil coming out was still thicker than the oil going in. Also, it was interesting to see that the oil is actually red in color. The OE oil was a like a slightly browned engine oil, but the new oil was... well take a look. I am guessing this oil is much more akin to ATF than traditional manual trans oil.





    Initial impressions are that the transmission does shift a little smoother. Ambient temperature was about 65F though, so it was already warmish.

    The car currently has 85,002 miles on it. The plan is to send in a transmission fluid sample after about 5k miles. This will likely take me about a year to do since I do not commute very far.
    If I interpret your info correctly, this last tank includes the new thinner MT-LV manual transmission lubricant.
    Last edited by Eggman; 09-07-2019 at 01:35 AM.

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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 49.7 mpg (US) ... 21.1 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 59.7 mpg (Imp)


  6. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daox View Post
    I would say the LRR tires are good for 2-3 mpg gain, the alternator delete is good for about the same.
    That's still too optimistic, I'm afraid. A gallon of petrol equals to about 9.45kWh. (Still 10kWh/L, engine efficiency 25%). So a car on 50mpg runs 50m/9.45kWh, which equals 0.189kWh/mile. To gain 2mpg, that has to be 4% lower, which is 0.0076kWh/mile = 7.6Wh/mile, which is 0.63Ah/mile at 12V.
    Your average speed is 28miles/h, so the saved current should be 17.6A. But you wrote the car uses about 8A. (4Ah in half an hour), which is less than a half, so the gain is less than 1mpg.

    Maybe the car uses 17.6A with headlights on. In that case 2mpg could be gained, if you charge the battery from another source. Charging from regeneration is unrealistic, as you should be regenerating at 100A for about 20% of the time.

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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2013 Space Star Cleartec Intense 1.0 manual: 54.8 mpg (US) ... 23.3 km/L ... 4.3 L/100 km ... 65.8 mpg (Imp)


  7. #196
    Administrator Daox's Avatar
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    You're right. The numbers don't exactly correspond. Something to mention is on EcoModder, someone suggested that my fancy ammeter may not be very accurate. I was hoping to help verify its accuracy with another gauge at some point.

    One thing to note that helps the numbers get closer is to take into consideration that alternator efficiency is around 50%.

    The closest testing I can point you toward is MetroMPG's testing on his Pontiac Firefly (Geo Metro). It is here:

    https://www.metrompg.com/posts/alternator-optional.htm

    Custom Mirage products: Cruise control kit, Glove box light, MAF sensor housing, Rear sway bar, Upper grill block

    Current project: DIY Nitrous oxide setup for ~$100

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 47.2 mpg (US) ... 20.1 km/L ... 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.7 mpg (Imp)


  8. #197
    Administrator Daox's Avatar
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    Today it was rainy and dark out, so on went the headlights and some wiper use. The trip using those accessories over doubled the power usage. This does include regen as well.

    I got the new gauge, but haven't installed it yet.

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    Custom Mirage products: Cruise control kit, Glove box light, MAF sensor housing, Rear sway bar, Upper grill block

    Current project: DIY Nitrous oxide setup for ~$100

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 47.2 mpg (US) ... 20.1 km/L ... 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.7 mpg (Imp)


  9. #198
    Administrator Daox's Avatar
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    For whatever reason, the alternator delete circuit stopped working the other day. I am guessing it's probably a bad solder joint since it's acting like it an open circuit and charging at 15V. The thing has just been flopping around in my center console for weeks now.

    So today's commute was done with the alternator on. I put the fuse back in place of my circuit. It was abnormally light traffic so I was able to push the mileage pretty high. 65 mpg was the result. My guess is if I had the delete working that it would be nearly 70 mpg though.

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    Custom Mirage products: Cruise control kit, Glove box light, MAF sensor housing, Rear sway bar, Upper grill block

    Current project: DIY Nitrous oxide setup for ~$100

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 47.2 mpg (US) ... 20.1 km/L ... 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.7 mpg (Imp)


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  11. #199
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    Alright, update time. I checked the circuit this past weekend. I found no problems. So, I tried the circuit again and it seems to be working perfectly again... I have no idea why it acted up again.

    So, I have been using it all this week and it's been great. Last night for example, I got home from work and plugged in. My wife and I had a meeting to go to and left about 30 minutes later. The charger was already done charging. That's a nice indication.

    This meeting was about a 35 minute drive there and 35 minutes back. The entire trip we had the heat going and headlights on. This was pulling about 20-25A from the battery. The battery is about 80Ah, and it was around freezing temperatures. As we kept going, I made sure to use regen as much as I could to keep it as charged as possible. The voltage started out at about 12.2V and slowly dropped until it was roughly 11.1V when we got home.

    What I really found interesting was how regeneration acted as the battery became more and more discharged. Usually, on my trip to work I engage the alternator and it jumps to 60A or so and quickly tapers off to some lower number. Last night on the way home as soon as I would engage the alternator it would peg at ~80A and stay there. As the trip went on, I noticed it would jump to 80A, but the max voltage was lower and lower. Towards the end of the trip I was only a little over 13V while still charging at 80A. This makes sense of course, but it is a new observation for me.

    So it seems that on my daily commute I don't use enough battery capacity to get the battery out of the constant voltage mode of charging and into the constant current mode. Unfortunately this limits the power I can get out of the regen setup. On the plus side, my battery is definitely large enough and lasts longer than I thought it would, especially in the cold.
    Custom Mirage products: Cruise control kit, Glove box light, MAF sensor housing, Rear sway bar, Upper grill block

    Current project: DIY Nitrous oxide setup for ~$100

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 47.2 mpg (US) ... 20.1 km/L ... 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.7 mpg (Imp)


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  13. #200
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    I'm late in the game. But it appears to me, you could just swap the battery out with a Capacitor pack, or a 4 cell Lithium battery? (like those motorcycle LEGO battery packs)?
    It's lighter, it's smaller, and it doesn't need as much charging.
    It also keeps (full) charge longer.
    A capacitor pack not as much, they might deplete overnight, but usually charge within like a few seconds.
    Which reminds me, I bought a USB battery pack (one of those 11000mAh battery packs) and it had a built in car starter (400CCA, up to 4L engines it said). It's not meant to start a car by itself, but to aid with the battery that's already present in the car.
    But use that on a 3 cylinder, 1,2L engine, and you probably don't even need a car battery.
    I tried starting my 800CC motorcycle with it, after the battery was totally dead, and it worked!

    So what stops anyone from just installing 2x $35 5F (rated, in reality they're 1F or 2F) capacitors, those huge water bottle size caps, and pair it with a USB battery pack for starting? That's not even 5LBS on starting gear vs 40?



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