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Thread: 2012 Scion iQ vs 2018 Mitsubishi Mirage

  1. #11
    Administrator MetroMPG's Avatar
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    - "Dead" steering
    - Worse body roll

    Cheap and easy fix for that with one of Daox's (or any aftermarket) rear stabilizer bar. It won't "cure" the dead steering, but it'll feel somewhat more responsive.

    Mitsu should have made this an option or put it on certain trims from Day 1.


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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2014 Mirage base ES 1.2 manual: 54.0 mpg (US) ... 23.0 km/L ... 4.4 L/100 km ... 64.9 mpg (Imp)


  2. #12
    Still Plays With Cars Loren's Avatar
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    For every person who complains of numb steering, if it were properly "responsive", there would be 5 who would complain that it was too wandery or unstable or didn't track straight or was too hard to steer or didn't ride smoothly enough. Such is the nature of this market segment.

    If you want crisp steering in this kind of car, your first modification is tires. Narrow eco-rated tires are not intended to be responsive. Then you can add a rear swaybar. If that's not enough, you go for shocks. But, it's hard to blame the car makers... they're designing a car to appeal to the masses. (as best they can while still achieving their design goals) Mitsubishi must be doing something right, they've sold 100,000 of them in the US.

    Everything is a compromise.
    Simplify and add lightness.

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    Member timw4mail's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loren View Post
    For every person who complains of numb steering, if it were properly "responsive", there would be 5 who would complain that it was too wandery or unstable or didn't track straight or was too hard to steer or didn't ride smoothly enough. Such is the nature of this market segment.

    If you want crisp steering in this kind of car, your first modification is tires. Narrow eco-rated tires are not intended to be responsive. Then you can add a rear swaybar. If that's not enough, you go for shocks. But, it's hard to blame the car makers... they're designing a car to appeal to the masses. (as best they can while still achieving their design goals) Mitsubishi must be doing something right, they've sold 100,000 of them in the US.

    Everything is a compromise.
    I don't think I mean the same thing when it comes to steering. I don't have a problem with the responsiveness of the steering. What I have an issue with is that you can't feel the tires pushing back through the steering -- you can't physically feel how much you are turning through the wheel. (On the other hand, the body (by default) gives too much of that kind of feedback, but I digress.)

    I think this is partially due to the electronic steering. Since the iQ also has electronic steering, I have to assume that there is some mechanism added to give more feedback to the steering wheel.

    At least for the 2018 Mirage I have, I don't have as much issue with the body roll as I do with the steering feel. The car does have more body roll than I'd like, but the car seems more planted than you'd expect for the amount of body roll.


    Gee, physical sensations are difficult to describe verbally.

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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2018 Mirage SE 1.2 automatic: 33.6 mpg (US) ... 14.3 km/L ... 7.0 L/100 km ... 40.4 mpg (Imp)


  4. #14
    Still Plays With Cars Loren's Avatar
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    It's mostly tires and shocks.

    The iQ has more treadwidth per pound, and a lower profile tire. That in itself has an effect. 175/60 = 105mm sidewall height. 165/65 = 99mm. It all adds up. I'd bet that the Mirage has a much more "eco" tire than the iQ. Being a Scion, the iQ would have been a little more on the "sporty" end of the curve. (not a lot... but, a little)

    Same with the shock valving that Toyota chose for the iQ. On the comfort vs. handling compromise, I would expect that car to be more on the sporty side.

    People always complain about whatever the newest technology is. Our electric power steering isn't the problem. We have direct rack-and-pinion steering, there's just a little motor that "assists" our efforts. The steering feel is there. The under-controlled body roll (shocks) and tall, soft sidewalls on the tires are what's taking away that feel.

    The power steering can be tuned to deliver more or less boost, as well. There could surely be some difference in that tuning between the iQ and the Mirage. But, again, it's all about compromises.

    I'll put it this way, I've made zero changes to the steering rack or power steering in my Mirage. I changed the tires, the shocks, the springs, and a little bit of suspension geometry. But, not the steering. Everybody who drives it says "damn, that's way more fun than I expected it to be". They're not saying that because it's fast. It's still a Mirage, it's not fast. They're saying that because it has crisp handling and crazy grip and goes where you point it! The steering is honestly fantastic! No complaints about that at all.

    Another thing you can look at is alignment. Not just the infamously suspect rear alignment, but front alignment. Particularly, the front toe. By default, it's probably spec'd to be just a little bit toed in. However much it's toed in, you could toe it out by the same amount and not affect tire wear. Try adjusting it more toward zero toe. Toe-in inherently wants to go straight. Keeping a LITTLE bit of that is not a bad thing. But, if you want quicker turn-in, bring it closer to zero toe. (or, if you really want to play with it, go a little toe-out... but, that might make the car a little "wandery") It's another compromise. One that most people don't think about.


    Simplify and add lightness.

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