Road Tripping a 2017 CVT

[Loren]

The highest point in FL is almost in Alabama.

So, I spent an hour cleaning the windows today. White paint spatters all over, I guess Mom must have painted the side of her house with the car parked nearby.

The rest of the car checks out fine, except... the front tires are shot. I knew they were thin. But, the part that I could see before wasn't THAT bad. There's uneven wear on the inside edges of the front tires, and there are some belts showing in spots. Damn!

Now I have to decide if I want to just replace the front tires, or slap the 15's off of my Mirage on there.

[Adam - UK]

My Mom was shopping for a new car a couple years ago, and I suggested she look at a Mirage. She did, and she ended up buying a pretty spartan brand new 2017 model with a CVT. It's got Bluetooth and foglights, that's about it. Over the past few years, she racked up 25,000 trouble-free miles on it, and she was very happy with it.

She passed away a few weeks ago, and my sisters offered me an irresistable deal on the car. (low trade-in value x 3/4 because it's already 1/4 mine) So, I bought it and offered it to my son for a little less than half what I paid for it because I know he needs a car. Of course, he didn't pass up that deal. And I've volunteered to deliver it to him.

He's in Kansas. I'm in Florida. Road trip!

I'll be making the trek solo, and I've given myself an easy 3 days to drive 1500+ miles. Absolute minimum 22 hours driving time. I'm more likely to do it in 25-27 hours plus stops. I'm not in a hurry, and I'll hypermile it and stay off of the Interstates as much as possible.

Picked up the car today. Drove it 45 miles on back roads, averaging about 40 mph, peaking at about 52 mph. Was amazed that I was able to hit 55 mpg EASILY, and by the time I got home, I'd seen 62 for a little bit, and managed to hang onto 60.7 mpg! Drove out to dinner after that, and still only dropped down to 55.8.

I really want to hate this car and its silly CVT. But, for just bombing around town... I'll deny ever having said this... it's perfect. It's always in the right gear. It will keep the revs ABSURDLY low if you want it to, and even accelerating at a constant 2k rpm... it still accelerates well enough to keep up with most traffic. And it COASTS better than a manual. With a manual, you're either in-gear coasting, or you're neutral coasting. When you lift off-throttle, the CVT seems to essentially put you in neutral (without the in-gear drag of a manual), but it gives the engine just barely enough momentum to keep it at 1200 rpm, and I assume it's keeping it in DFCO. It's a hypermiler's dream! It's not as engaging as a manual transmission, but it truly is a technological marvel... and now I'm going to have to read more about how it works.

And I think it's really bizarre to set the rpm with the right foot, watch the tach stay put, and the speedo rise. It doesn't rise QUICKLY, but it definitely does so deliberately. You don't feel like you're accelerating because the revs don't change... but, before you know it, you're up to 40-45 mph without ever having revved over 2k.

Anyhow, I'll be giving the car a once-over tomorrow. The oil was changed last month, and it has one new tire on the rear. (sis damaged one on a misplaced drain grate) The other 3 are OE and close to 1/3 tread. The car is completely stock and I've already set the tire pressures to 40 psi.

I did buy a set of rubber donut spring spacers to put in the springs. I'm going to stuff those in there tomorrow to see if I like it firmer. I really didn't hate it today, it handles well enough. Very predictable with delightfully nimble steering. The ride is comfortable, but I think just a touch more stiffness would not be unwelcome. We'll see.

Otherwise, I'll probably up the tire pressures to 45 or so. And I need to check the alignment. The steering wheel is slightly off-center. Might tweak the front toe to get that straight.

Road trip begins Friday afternoon!

sorry to here about your mother

tire pressures to 45 A bit high don;t that compromise handling mine is 35 psi

[Loren]

Well, I opted to swap the wheels off of my Mirage. So, now this one has 15x6.5 Konig Heliums with 185/55 T1-R's. I'll run them at at least 40 psi. 45 if it's not too harsh. (and the suspension is SO soft... I don't think I'd notice)

Curious to see what effect the wider non-eco tires and non-aero wheels have on MPG.

[Dirk Diggler]

My parents live in Mt. Pleasent. My Dad was recently diagnosed with Lewy Bodies dementia. I go down to help, as Im a memory care specialist nurse aide.

[Wallythacker]

Condolences.

The 2k or less RPM while accelerating, while crusing @70mph, while in the city while delivering 55mpg were absolute lockdown sales points for me.

i thought the mileage computer was busted until I did a fillup.

[Top_Fuel]

I really want to hate this car and its silly CVT.
...for just bombing around town...it's perfect
...It's always in the right gear
...It will keep the revs ABSURDLY low if you want it to
...it COASTS better than a manual

I've never driven a CVT Mirage but would really like to try it...especially after reading your comments. I always assumed the opposite...that a CVT would not be so great in town but would be nice on the freeway due to the lower RPMs. I'll be interested to see your fuel mileage numbers during your trip! Be sure to experiment using the cruise control to take advantage of the Mirage's lower RPM cruise control logic.

The steering wheel is slightly off-center.

Mine has been like that since day 1. I had the dealer align my car under warranty...but I forgot to mention the wheel being off-center. I've just been too lazy to correct it myself.

I opted to swap the wheels off of my Mirage. So, now this one has 15x6.5 Konig Heliums with 185/55 T1-R's.
Curious to see what effect the wider non-eco tires and non-aero wheels have on MPG.

Hope your son appreciates that extra bonus...lol. I think the non-LRR tires might cost you 2 mpg?!?

Don't forget to add 2.5% to your odometer readings when calculating your fuel mileage with the 185-55s. It's not a big amount but it adds up.

...the front tires are shot.
...There's uneven wear on the inside edges of the front tires, and there are some belts showing in spots.

That's a bummer. Hopefully just the front end is out of whack.

[Pryme]

I've never driven a CVT Mirage but would really like to try it...especially after reading your comments. I always assumed the opposite...that a CVT would not be so great in town but would be nice on the freeway due to the lower RPMs. I'll be interested to see your fuel mileage numbers during your trip! Be sure to experiment using the cruise control to take advantage of the Mirage's lower RPM cruise control logic.


Mine has been like that since day 1. I had the dealer align my car under warranty...but I forgot to mention the wheel being off-center. I've just been too lazy to correct it myself.


Hope your son appreciates that extra bonus...lol. I think the non-LRR tires might cost you 2 mpg?!?

Don't forget to add 2.5% to your odometer readings when calculating your fuel mileage with the 185-55s. It's not a big amount but it adds up.


That's a bummer. Hopefully just the front end is out of whack.

For me, and I know everyone has different likes and needs but I first test drove only the cvt and don't think I would have bought a mirage if the manual was not available. I just don't like the feel of cvt transmissions. Especially when getting on the gas and having that runner band feeling of the acceleration catching up to the engine note. I liked the car though and knew I'd like it in a stick so drove 270mi based on my test drive to pu the manual cars

[Loren]

Good news and bad news.

The good news is that the car was mostly a joy to drive and has been trouble free, of course. The more time I spend with it, the more I learned its quirks, just like any car.

The bad news is that my first tank mileage was WAY off of the onboard estimate. And I'd worked so hard trying to hold onto 50 mpg on that tank that it pissed me off, and I just gave up on hypermiling it. The dash said 46.9 mpg, actual was 38.42! My initial fill must have been light, and my final fill heavy. But, to make the numbers work, the fuel would have had to be off by 1.1 GALLONS.

Hang on, I didn't do the tire size correction. And I just did a calibration based on the first leg of my trip. I noted actual locations throughout the trip. So, the first leg by Google Maps was 256.0 miles. By odometer, it was 245.5. The difference is right inline with the tire size difference, so that makes sense. I'll call it a correction factor of 1.04 for mileage.

That puts the corrected onboard reading at 48.78 (woohoo!), and the actual at 39.96. Would still take 1.15 gallons of fuel to balance that equation. Can't think of anything else. I didn't do anything weird. No EOC. No neutral-coasting. Just straight up gentle accel, limiting speed to 52 mph, and judicious extended glides whenever the circumstances were right. I had it up to over 52 on the display, but the last 30 minutes or so before I filled up, the road got really lonely and I opted to add speed.

Anyhow. The REST of my fill-ups, while the MPG was awful (for a hypermiler in a Mirage), were fairly accurate. These are corrected numbers:
38.8 actual, 38.3 displayed
37.8 actual, 37.5 displayed
35.6 actual, 36.8 displayed
37.4 actual, 37.8 displayed

So, the trend is that the display is typically within about 1%, which is pretty good. I'd bet that the display is more accurate, and the error is in the fill-up. These were all partial fills. (I did a lot of late-night driving last night in very out-of-the-way places, so I filled up early to avoid getting stranded) 5-6 gallons. 1% of 5 gallons is .05. I'd be surprised if a typical fill, even on the same pump is consistent to within a tenth!

Yep. Gave up hypermiling for this trip. Just went for having a little fun, learning the car more, and "getting there". Throwing out the first tank as questionable, the rest of the trip has an overall average of 37.95 mpg. Considering I opted for a cruising speed that was typically 65-70, and was just out having fun, I guess that's not too bad.

I did notice pretty early on yesterday that just like my 5-speed, MPG takes a serious dive after about 60 mpg. The sweet spot if you want to keep 50 mpg is to stay below 55. The average will keep slowly ticking up as long as you keep it below that. As soon as you edge up to 60, it starts ticking down rather than up.

I also noticed that my initial thoughts about the CVT "coasting better" than the manual were wrong. It's still dragging the momentum down when you take your foot off the gas. Maybe not quite as much as a manual, but it's not free-wheeling like I thought it was, either.

Don't know how this fits in with hypermiling (probably doesn't), but I did adopt the "use sport mode for acceleration" tactic today. For acceleration. For keeping up with fast-moving traffic on hills. For just general "responsiveness" when you need it. Slap it in sport mode. I don't think it gives you anything you couldn't get by just mashing your foot to the floor. But, you do get more control than that. More responsiveness. I like it.

The car handles better than it has any right to (with good tires under it), but I think the rear shocks are near dead after 25k miles. Very wallowy back there. But, after about the first 6 hours, I got used to it and learned to work with it. I did put the rubber spring spacers on all four corners. They're not quite active at static load, so they won't affect small bumps. Bigger bumps will engage them, I suppose (I'd have to do some serious back-to-back testing to really tell). And when you roll into a corner, they will engage after about the first half-inch of body roll and firm up the spring rate a little bit. (I calculated how much... but, then I forgot... whatever cutting out one coil does) So, this setup probably isn't rolling quite as much as stock in a turn, and the second half of the roll is slightly firmer. If the rear shocks didn't suck, it would be great!

I've got probably two more fill-ups before this trip is done. I may or may not bother tracking them. I think I've learned about all I can from this trip, and I'm not likely to have time to do any more proper hypermiling.

[Pryme]

Good news and bad news.

The good news is that the car was mostly a joy to drive and has been trouble free, of course. The more time I spend with it, the more I learned its quirks, just like any car.

The bad news is that my first tank mileage was WAY off of the onboard estimate. And I'd worked so hard trying to hold onto 50 mpg on that tank that it pissed me off, and I just gave up on hypermiling it. The dash said 46.9 mpg, actual was 38.42! My initial fill must have been light, and my final fill heavy. But, to make the numbers work, the fuel would have had to be off by 1.1 GALLONS.

Hang on, I didn't do the tire size correction. And I just did a calibration based on the first leg of my trip. I noted actual locations throughout the trip. So, the first leg by Google Maps was 256.0 miles. By odometer, it was 245.5. The difference is right inline with the tire size difference, so that makes sense. I'll call it a correction factor of 1.04 for mileage.

That puts the corrected onboard reading at 48.78 (woohoo!), and the actual at 39.96. Would still take 1.15 gallons of fuel to balance that equation. Can't think of anything else. I didn't do anything weird. No EOC. No neutral-coasting. Just straight up gentle accel, limiting speed to 52 mph, and judicious extended glides whenever the circumstances were right. I had it up to over 52 on the display, but the last 30 minutes or so before I filled up, the road got really lonely and I opted to add speed.

Anyhow. The REST of my fill-ups, while the MPG was awful (for a hypermiler in a Mirage), were fairly accurate. These are corrected numbers:
38.8 actual, 38.3 displayed
37.8 actual, 37.5 displayed
35.6 actual, 36.8 displayed
37.4 actual, 37.8 displayed

So, the trend is that the display is typically within about 1%, which is pretty good. I'd bet that the display is more accurate, and the error is in the fill-up. These were all partial fills. (I did a lot of late-night driving last night in very out-of-the-way places, so I filled up early to avoid getting stranded) 5-6 gallons. 1% of 5 gallons is .05. I'd be surprised if a typical fill, even on the same pump is consistent to within a tenth!

Yep. Gave up hypermiling for this trip. Just went for having a little fun, learning the car more, and "getting there". Throwing out the first tank as questionable, the rest of the trip has an overall average of 37.95 mpg. Considering I opted for a cruising speed that was typically 65-70, and was just out having fun, I guess that's not too bad.

I did notice pretty early on yesterday that just like my 5-speed, MPG takes a serious dive after about 60 mpg. The sweet spot if you want to keep 50 mpg is to stay below 55. The average will keep slowly ticking up as long as you keep it below that. As soon as you edge up to 60, it starts ticking down rather than up.

I also noticed that my initial thoughts about the CVT "coasting better" than the manual were wrong. It's still dragging the momentum down when you take your foot off the gas. Maybe not quite as much as a manual, but it's not free-wheeling like I thought it was, either.

Don't know how this fits in with hypermiling (probably doesn't), but I did adopt the "use sport mode for acceleration" tactic today. For acceleration. For keeping up with fast-moving traffic on hills. For just general "responsiveness" when you need it. Slap it in sport mode. I don't think it gives you anything you couldn't get by just mashing your foot to the floor. But, you do get more control than that. More responsiveness. I like it.

The car handles better than it has any right to (with good tires under it), but I think the rear shocks are near dead after 25k miles. Very wallowy back there. But, after about the first 6 hours, I got used to it and learned to work with it. I did put the rubber spring spacers on all four corners. They're not quite active at static load, so they won't affect small bumps. Bigger bumps will engage them, I suppose (I'd have to do some serious back-to-back testing to really tell). And when you roll into a corner, they will engage after about the first half-inch of body roll and firm up the spring rate a little bit. (I calculated how much... but, then I forgot... whatever cutting out one coil does) So, this setup probably isn't rolling quite as much as stock in a turn, and the second half of the roll is slightly firmer. If the rear shocks didn't suck, it would be great!

I've got probably two more fill-ups before this trip is done. I may or may not bother tracking them. I think I've learned about all I can from this trip, and I'm not likely to have time to do any more proper hypermiling.

Yeah, the cvt is not close to the manual in mileage. I've personally never got that poor of mileage. For a tank the lowest I see is 45

[Loren]

It still seems to shine in casual City driving.

I noticed some CVT weirdness that I may start a new thread on. I'm not likely to ever drive another one, myself. But, the discussion could help some new CVT owners.