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Thread: Mirage MSRP too expensive? Complaint!

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark View Post
    A Ford Focus or Fiesta with a dual-clutch automatic transmissions would be one of the last cars in the U.S. market I would buy. I would avoid them like the plague (probably a poor choice of words).
    They don't make a Fiesta ST with a dual-clutch automatic transmission thankfully...


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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2014 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 44.4 mpg (US) ... 18.9 km/L ... 5.3 L/100 km ... 53.3 mpg (Imp)


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    fc321 (10-07-2020)

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    Senior Member fc321's Avatar
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    I can kind of see your point. I was lucky to get mine for $9000 but they gave me a high interest load from Ally that ended up costing me $1000 in finance charges just in year one so I quickly paid off the entire loan in the beginning of year 2. So basically i paid 10k for mine. And for THAT PRICE it is a good deal but I can understand your feelings and if the price had been 16k I would have probably bought something else.

    But for my next car i would like to buy a small electric-only car. Such as this BaoJun E300 that sells for $8000 new:



    Well, maybe not THAT one in particular but something similar. I have been attracted to electric cars but I have patiently waited for the prices to come down on them and basically what I have been waiting for is a small electric car for under $10k that is tiny like our Mirage. But alas, that day has still not arrived. I am only on year 5 ownership of my Mirage so will keep it at least 5 more years and hopefully by that time the prices on electric cars have come down enough.

    Its going to take some time because in USA nobody likes small cars so there is not much of a market for them. It will take a huge price hike in the cost of gasoline for any dumb American to get interested in small cars again. And it actually makes the roads more dangerous for people like me that ride motorcycle and a small Mirage. With the trend of BIGGER and BIGGER SUVs and PickUp trucks it is becoming more and more dangerous for small vehicles.

    Man, I cant stand those big obnoxious LIFTED pickup Trucks. And the drivers are so obnoxious too, one of those *******s threw a cigarette butt at me when I was on my motorcycle at the red light. Good thing I wear a full face helmet. These little-d1ck men have something to prove.
    2015 Mirage DE 5 speed Manual - 30k miles

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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 44.9 mpg (US) ... 19.1 km/L ... 5.2 L/100 km ... 53.9 mpg (Imp)


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    Eggman (10-07-2020)

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    How cheap can they go? I don't like dealers but I don't think they have a lot of profit here or motivation to sell for less. If everyone is charging more and this is still the cheapest vehicle they have no need.

    Since 2015-2020 there has been a 10% increase in cost just due to inflation. That can explain ~$1200. Also I'm sure part of the reason these are so cheap is just due to being made in Thailand. If this had to be made in a US Union GM plant you could probably add 50% to the price just like the chevy Spark not made in the US.

    Then you have the stealerships. Median car dealer salary is $42k a year. Medium to large car dealers could have 40-65 employees and the building/property they need to pay for.

    According to a basic google search dealers make about 20% of a sale. 20% of 10k is only 2k. This means they would need to sell about 840 mirages a year just to pay for 40 staff excluding other expenses.

    There were only 27k mirages sold in the US in 2019 among 350 dealers. This is only 77 mirages per dealer.
    At 20% profit for a dealer this is only $154k.

    In Canada only 2270 were sold among 90 dealers. This is only 25 per dealer.
    At 20% profit this is only about $50k USD.

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2019 Mirage ES 1.2 automatic: 38.8 mpg (US) ... 16.5 km/L ... 6.1 L/100 km ... 46.5 mpg (Imp)


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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirageman38 View Post
    How cheap can they go? I don't like dealers but I don't think they have a lot of profit here or motivation to sell for less. If everyone is charging more and this is still the cheapest vehicle they have no need.

    Since 2015-2020 there has been a 10% increase in cost just due to inflation. That can explain ~$1200. Also I'm sure part of the reason these are so cheap is just due to being made in Thailand. If this had to be made in a US Union GM plant you could probably add 50% to the price just like the chevy Spark not made in the US.

    Then you have the stealerships. Median car dealer salary is $42k a year. Medium to large car dealers could have 40-65 employees and the building/property they need to pay for.

    According to a basic google search dealers make about 20% of a sale. 20% of 10k is only 2k. This means they would need to sell about 840 mirages a year just to pay for 40 staff excluding other expenses.

    There were only 27k mirages sold in the US in 2019 among 350 dealers. This is only 77 mirages per dealer.
    At 20% profit for a dealer this is only $154k.

    In Canada only 2270 were sold among 90 dealers. This is only 25 per dealer.
    At 20% profit this is only about $50k USD.
    31,280 Sparks sold in 2019, & there are approximately 3,000 Chevy dealerships. That equals 10.43 Sparks/dealership. Their focus is selling Chevy pickups and SUVs, however.

    The MSRP & destination charge on a 2020 Mirage ES CVT is only $1,501 less than a 128 hp Honda LX CVT. Unless you are interested in a Mirage & investigate pricing, it's an easy car to overlook. Read a couple bad reviews & you write it off. I have 25 Chevy dealerships closer to where I live than the nearest Mitsubishi dealership. Those are all factors for some. Honda/Toyota dealerships in my area have an excellent reputation. Local Mitsubishi dealership was closed down by the Wisconsin DMV this spring for its shady practices. How often do you hear that about a dealership? I am not aware of good Mitsubishi dealership in Wisconsin. My Mirage came from Minnesota. Not everyone is willing to buy a car that way.

    I don't think the Mirage needs to be given away, but dealerships are all over the place with pricing. My local Mitsubishi dealership wanted $3,000+ OTD for the same car I bought elsewhere. That's quite a difference for a cheap economy car.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark View Post
    31,280 Sparks sold in 2019, & there are approximately 3,000 Chevy dealerships. That equals 10.43 Sparks/dealership. Their focus is selling Chevy pickups and SUVs, however.

    The MSRP & destination charge on a 2020 Mirage ES CVT is only $1,501 less than a 128 hp Honda LX CVT. Unless you are interested in a Mirage & investigate pricing, it's an easy car to overlook. Read a couple bad reviews & you write it off. I have 25 Chevy dealerships closer to where I live than the nearest Mitsubishi dealership. Those are all factors for some. Honda/Toyota dealerships in my area have an excellent reputation. Local Mitsubishi dealership was closed down by the Wisconsin DMV this spring for its shady practices. How often do you hear that about a dealership? I am not aware of good Mitsubishi dealership in Wisconsin. My Mirage came from Minnesota. Not everyone is willing to buy a car that way.

    I don't think the Mirage needs to be given away, but dealerships are all over the place with pricing. My local Mitsubishi dealership wanted $3,000+ OTD for the same car I bought elsewhere. That's quite a difference for a cheap economy car.
    Chevy dealers likely could care less about Spark sales. What do Mitsubishi dealers have to fall back on? LOL the Outlander? Chevy has a robust line of vehicles designed for the American market. Mitsubishi doesn't.

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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2019 Mirage ES 1.2 automatic: 38.8 mpg (US) ... 16.5 km/L ... 6.1 L/100 km ... 46.5 mpg (Imp)


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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirageman38 View Post
    Chevy dealers likely could care less about Spark sales. What do Mitsubishi dealers have to fall back on? LOL the Outlander? Chevy has a robust line of vehicles designed for the American market. Mitsubishi doesn't.
    Bergstrom Automotive carries 36 brands of vehicles. Largest automotive franchise in Wisconsin. I don't think they fret over their Mitsubishi sales, and their inventory sort of reflects that.

    https://www.bergstromauto.com/

    They have a huge auto market in the Fox Valley area (between Green Bay & Milwaukee) of Wisconsin. They have one used Mirage in stock, which happens to be Pryme's former Mirage that he traded in for KIA van. That's their entire inventory for the Mirage.

    Some Mitsubishi dealerships could also care less about Mirage sales apparently.

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    I don't think I would pay full price for a brand new Mirage with the highest trim level. Once you get close to $20k there are a lot of other options out there.

    When I got my Space Star I was looking for a new/newish car with an automatic transmission, power windows/doors/mirrors, cruise control, A/C, and a good warranty. My budget was CHF 15,000 and the only new car I found here that fit my criteria was the Space Star. Sure, I found some 1 or 2 year old Hyundais or Toyotas available within my budget, but they were never as well equipped as the 2019 Space Stars I found and after my recent bad experience with a used car I was hesitant to buy anything with over 5,000 kms.

    In the end I found a new 2019 Space Star that is almost completely loaded and paid CHF 13,900 in total. The Space Star doesn't have fancy plush plastics, but it has everything I wanted and even some unexpected extras (auto lights, auto wipers, heated seats, infotainment system).

    Dealers here are selling the redesigned 2020 Space Stars for more, and to get the same trim in a 2020 model will cost about CHF 18,000 or 19,000, which is way more than I would pay for this car. I was quoted just over 19,000 for a 2020 model but I got the 2019 model for 5,000 less with almost all of the same options as the 2020 model.

  10. #18
    Senior Member Dirk Diggler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Basic View Post
    18k will get you a year old Fiesta ST with less than 10k miles on it... I guarantee that's the route I would go.
    Only in manual though. Have you read the articles about Ford's massive class action lawsuit about its dry dual clutch system? Makes Nissan's lawsuit look like a slap on the wrist.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler View Post
    Only in manual though. Have you read the articles about Ford's massive class action lawsuit about its dry dual clutch system? Makes Nissan's lawsuit look like a slap on the wrist.
    Ford deceived buyers by not referring to the PowerShift transmission as an automated manual, instead calling it an automatic transmission. Nissan at least has been more transparent by informing consumers that they are buying a CVT transmission and not a traditional geared AT.

    Professor John Kelly at WeberAuto on YouTube has an excellent video in which he explains and reassembles the six speed PowerShift transaxle on a stand on a lab bench. The PowerShift would've been a great transmission if it had used a wet clutch. Not sure why Ford went with a dry one - probably cheaper.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler View Post
    Only in manual though. Have you read the articles about Ford's massive class action lawsuit about its dry dual clutch system? Makes Nissan's lawsuit look like a slap on the wrist.
    They only make the Fiesta ST in manual.


    Resident Tire Engineer

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2014 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 44.4 mpg (US) ... 18.9 km/L ... 5.3 L/100 km ... 53.3 mpg (Imp)


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