CVT maintenance, oil replacement: is it mandatory? The manual says...

[karmakoma]

Good morning,
I have been reading your forum for a little while and am currently asking myself many questions about CVT maintenance.
In a couple of months I will get possession of a Suzuki CVT (Jatco 7 classic) and I live in Europe. In Europe, the manual states (and I quote literally) about the cvt:

"check, clean, lubricate or replace as required the flow control"

You can find this in the CH manual but in germany is the same:

https://auto.suzuki.ch/fileadmin/med...leitung_DE.pdf

So there is no mention of cleaning the magnetic filters or necessarily changing the fluid. I wonder with the original fluid how long this transmission might last (or if the fluid though checked is never replaced because it is still considered good in terms of color and level).
Are there any examples of cars on the forum that have passed 80,000 miles without having had CVT fluid/filter changes? The mirage is identical to the swift in terms of weight and transmission so I don´t expect much difference in durability and behaviour.

[Mark]

Using my 2017 Mirage Warranty & Maintenance Manual -

Schedule 1 states -
Change manual transmission fluid @ 30,000 miles.
Check automatic transmission fluid level & condition @ 15,000 miles.
Change automatic transmission fluid @ 30,000 miles.

Schedule 2 states -
Check manual transmission fluid level & condition @ 30,000 miles.

There is no mention of automatic transmission fluid for schedule 2. I guess some could interpret that as you don't have to do anything ever if you follow schedule 2.

As far as changing filters go, I've never seen or heard of a lifetime filter. Changing the fluid and not cleaning or changing the filters sounds like someone taking a shower & putting dirty underwear back on afterwards.

Personally, I would not follow schedule 2 for a Mirage.

What is your goal in asking your question?

Do you want your vehicle to last at least 100,000 miles or do you want it to last as long as possible with the fewest needed repairs?

[Ares]

I'm guilty of not changing manual tranny fluid @ 30k miles. Tranny had to be changed at 75k.

I think for the 5MT, it's just fluid drain/fill right?

[Mark]

I'm guilty of not changing manual tranny fluid @ 30k miles. Tranny had to be changed at 75k.

I think for the 5MT, it's just fluid drain/fill right?

A manual has a drain plug and fill plug. Drain it, refill it until it comes out the fill plug opening, and you are done. No filters to change.

I did mine at 30,000 miles, but the factory fluid looked very good. Thus, I've decided to do it @ the 50,000 mile interval the next time. I am above 76,000 miles at the moment. My next oil change will be the engine oil & manual fluid @ 80,000 miles.

[bnas]

These CVT transmissions seem to be a hit and miss sometimes. Some people got into really high miles without a change of fluid others where not so lucky. My german Mitsubishi dealer also recommend to leave it alone and not change the fluid... i did it anyway including both filters @ just shy of 50k km. Theres no harm in maintaining your mirage if you dont mind the expenses, and even if it was too early atleast i can rest my mind knowing i did the best i could do to (hopefully) prolong the life of my CVT.

[Wallythacker]

In all my ownership of MT cars only my Porsche had a transmission oil change. Mostly because I didn't want to replace a $8k (in the day) Lots of my MT cars were driven hard with high loads and never had an issue. I'd say that dropping the clutch 20 + times on a weekend with 540 HP behind it qualifies as "severe service" The only transmission issues I had in the manual world was in a Chevette, the synchros must have been soft, it was a common problem and no amount of frequent oil changes would have mitigated it.

[Mark]

In all my ownership of MT cars only my Porsche had a transmission oil change. Mostly because I didn't want to replace a $8k (in the day) Lots of my MT cars were driven hard with high loads and never had an issue. I'd say that dropping the clutch 20 + times on a weekend with 540 HP behind it qualifies as "severe service" The only transmission issues I had in the manual world was in a Chevette, the synchros must have been soft, it was a common problem and no amount of frequent oil changes would have mitigated it.

All of my vehicles have been manuals, & I can't say that I changed the transmission fluid in most of them. Some I didn't keep long that long in my earlier days.

I base some of what I do on Steve's plastic car that he sold @ 300,000+ miles. Steve's Mirage had done 60+ (5W-30 conventional) oil/filter changes, & he never reported any engine issues.

Although I did 0W-20 full synthetic (mostly Mobil 1 Fuel economy) every 5,000 miles for a couple years, I have switched over to Super Tech 5W-30 Full Synthetic oil (along with a mid-priced 10,000 mile oil filter) changed every 5,000 miles. Since Steve's Mirage did well with conventional oil, I'm somewhat assuming mine will do just as well with Full Synthetic. I am not a fan of lightweight oil, but I wouldn't go overboard on that either. I feel better using 5W-30 over 0W-20, but that's a personal choice. Other markets don't recommend only one oil choice for the Mirage.

As far as transmissions go, Steve did develop a manual transmission issue & he replaced it before selling it. Steve did not follow the recommended fluid changes for his transmission. Would that have made a difference? I really don't know. I just know he had transmission problems in the end. Thus, I am willing to service my manual transmission. It's less than 2 quarts of fluid, & it's relatively easy to do.

This is totally off the topic of CVT maintenance, but I would do 30,000 miles fluid changes if I owned a CVT Mirage. I would learn how to change out the filters, too.

[7milesout]

My german Mitsubishi dealer also recommend to leave it alone and not change the fluid

So, the German dealership staff are just as wrong as the American's huh? If I want the answer to something car wise, I could call a dealer and do the opposite of what they say. That would be the correct thing to do most of the time.

[Ares]

A manual has a drain plug and fill plug. Drain it, refill it until it comes out the fill plug opening, and you are done. No filters to change.

I did mine at 30,000 miles, but the factory fluid looked very good. Thus, I've decided to do it @ the 50,000 mile interval the next time. I am above 76,000 miles at the moment. My next oil change will be the engine oil & manual fluid @ 80,000 miles.

That sounds so easy; I may do it on the mirage. What transmission fluid have you used?

[Mark]

That sounds so easy; I may do it on the mirage. What transmission fluid have you used?

To save you time, check out post #76 done by Top Fuel in the thread below. Top Fuel painted the drain & fill plugs red for the pics, which is awesome!!!!!

https://mirageforum.com/forum/showth...mission)/page8

In the United States, I would say most have used Redline MTL. Two quarts will do the job, but a gallon may be cheaper. I would compare the price @ the Walmart website or Amazon, & buy the cheapest with shipping included. Amazon is a lot cheaper than Walmart tonight (2 quarts & 1 gallon listed below).

https://www.amazon.com/Red-Line-Tran...gateway&sr=8-4

https://www.amazon.com/Red-Line-5020...3d670b6bc&th=1

I bought a gallon, & I have plenty leftover to do my 2nd fluid change. Like everything the price has gone up. If you do it yourself, however, the cost of the 2 quarts is your total cost.

I had to buy two items (correct funnel & socket) to make the job easier.

A long tube funnel is necessary. I bought one like this -

https://www.autozone.com/shop-and-ga...nel/557785_0_0

I also didn't have a 24 mm socket. If you buy one just make sure it matches whatever (3/8" or 1/2" drive) ratchet you have. Shop for the cheapest one you find (I didn't do that very well below) Examples -

1/2" drive -

https://www.amazon.com/Socket-2-Inch...43&sr=8-3&th=1

3/8" drive -

https://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-Drive-...2340b23c8&th=1