does shutting the engine off at lights wear out the starter faster?

[inuvik]

It seems there are more people who dislike auto-start-stop technologies, though.

Count me not just a dislike, but a festering hate for auto-start-stop

[sunbeam]

Its not the starter wear I would worry about it is the engine wear.

The start stop is much more damaging overall than simply idling.

The way I look at it, you can pay with more gasoline (easy) or you can pay with more engine / starter repairs (difficult).

To me the tradeoff of more gas consumption is not worth the additional savings.

Just my 2 cents on it.

[Eggman]

Its not the starter wear I would worry about it is the engine wear.

The start stop is much more damaging overall than simply idling.

But when shut off, isn't the engine already fully lubricated since it was just running?

[sunbeam]

But when shut off, isn't the engine already fully lubricated since it was just running?

But when shut off, isn't the engine already fully lubricated since it was just running?

In terms of wear even a heated up engine will have greater wear on startup compared to one that is continuously running but less than a cold engine.

Again, in terms of risk/reward, minor fuel savings at the expense of any additional engine wear to me is not worth the tradeoff.

This is my valuation of the situation, I prefer to pay with fuel for less maintenance (ie. premium fuel, minimize stops and starts).

I do not discount potential fuel savings from shutting the car off, I have read that 15 seconds is the break-even point from a fuel savings perspective.

[Fummins]

In terms of wear even a heated up engine will have greater wear on startup compared to one that is continuously running but less than a cold engine.

Again, in terms of risk/reward, minor fuel savings at the expense of any additional engine wear to me is not worth the tradeoff.

This is my valuation of the situation, I prefer to pay with fuel for less maintenance (ie. premium fuel, minimize stops and starts).

I do not discount potential fuel savings from shutting the car off, I have read that 15 seconds is the break-even point from a fuel savings perspective.

You had me until premium fuel.

[7milesout]

You had me until premium fuel.

I was on shaky ground even prior to premium fuel.

[Eggman]

What about after premium fuel?

[sunbeam]

What about after premium fuel?

I will not delve into the fuel debate haha, let me pull up a citation about the engine wear on start stop.

https://saemobilus.sae.org/content/600190/

Basically there is engine wear on start stop because of the sucking action of the oil, ie. when the car is running the oil is constantly circulating, but when you stop start there is increased wear in the time between the oil flowing.

Even in a warmed up car you will see more wear on the start stop.

Again, this is not to say that for industrial applications (delivery, car rental, taxi, etc.) that I would worry about it.
However, we are talking about voluntary start stops in order to save fuel, which in the long run I question the risk-reward ratio.

[Eggman]

I will not delve into the fuel debate haha, let me pull up a citation about the engine wear on start stop.

https://saemobilus.sae.org/content/600190/

Basically there is engine wear on start stop because of the sucking action of the oil, ie. when the car is running the oil is constantly circulating, but when you stop start there is increased wear in the time between the oil flowing.

Even in a warmed up car you will see more wear on the start stop.

Again, this is not to say that for industrial applications (delivery, car rental, taxi, etc.) that I would worry about it.
However, we are talking about voluntary start stops in order to save fuel, which in the long run I question the risk-reward ratio.

Before I dive headfirst into reading the paper, is there anything more current that discusses today's automatic stop/start systems? That paper is dated January 1, 1960 making it older than most forum members haha.

Article's first paragraph:

Studies in laboratory engines equipped with radioactive piston rings show that wear is highest during a cold startup. Corrosion by condensed combustion products is responsible.

Do you have any reference material that covers today's automatic start/stop systems on warm/hot engines?

[sunbeam]

Before I dive headfirst into reading the paper, is there anything more current that discusses today's automatic stop/start systems? That paper is dated January 1, 1960 making it older than most forum members haha.

Article's first paragraph:
Do you have any reference material that covers today's automatic start/stop systems on warm/hot engines?

Hi Eggman,

Age is not necessarily a predictor of relevance on certain topics, the laws of fluid mechanics have not changed. This was the best most complete reference I could find. This article is the one consistently referenced in magazine posts, so it is what I would use.

However, you could think about it this way, the same mechanism that causes damage in the cold start stop will cause damage (although less) in a regular start stop. We can think in an extreme case, a car start stopping once a day vs 100 times a day, the one start stopping less will have less wear.

The car companies give us this "auto start stop" "feature" because cynically they may have motives that are to sell more cars, not to make a car last as long as possible without breaking down.

Similarly, we may interpret some car manual recommendations with a grain of salt ie. massive oil change intervals, or like my manual says a 160,000km coolant change (preposterous in my opinion).

Just because consumers can be sold a feature does not mean the "feature" is beneficial for cars longevity. Many now treat cars like an iphone and want the newest gadget so to me, car companies are selling consumers what they want.