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Thread: Redline MT-LV 70W/75W gear oil for 5 speed manual

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    Redline MT-LV 70W/75W gear oil for 5 speed manual

    I was poking around today looking at different gear oils. Our cars call for a 75W80 gear oil. The 75W is the engine viscosity when cold, and the 80 is the viscosity when its hot. All oil is substantially thicker when cold, so getting a low first number is a good thing as it will always be thinner when hot. You just don't want it to get too thin, or you can accelerate wear in your transmission. Here is a chart to help illustrate things.

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    Therefore, I was looking to see if I could get a 70W80 or even 65W80. Alas, I can not find anything like that. However, what I did find was Redline MT-LV 70W/75W. You'll notice this doesn't follow the normal naming convention. So, I'm not exactly sure what to think about it. It is quite a bit thinner than Redline MTL 75W80 that many here have used.

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    Here are the viscosity specs of the two:

    75W/80 (OE spec)
    Vis @ 100C, CSt 10.2
    Vis @ 40C, CSt 50

    70W/75W
    Vis @ 100C, CSt 6.5
    Vis @ 40C, CSt 9.8


    For reference, 40C is 104F. That already seems warm for a manual transmission, but I haven't measured my transmission's temperature. Anyway, at 104F, you can see the 70W/75W is 5 times thinner than the 75W80 oil. Thats a heck of a lot less churning going on. Less churning means more power and efficiency.

    Anyways, I post this info because I am thinking about using it in the Mirage. I have contacted Blackstone Labs, a third party oil analysis company. I've asked them how they recommend I proceed with testing this oil with minimal risk to my transmission. I've used them many times in the past for engine oil analysis and they're very helpful.


    Custom Mirage products: Cruise control kit, Glove box light, MAF sensor housing, Rear sway bar, Upper grill block

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        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 47.2 mpg (US) ... 20.1 km/L ... 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.7 mpg (Imp)


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    This is interesting, Tim. How'd you find it? Do you think it's GL-4?

    Edit: Never mind - I see, following your link, that it is GL-4 and it is presented as a new product. Nice find.

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 49.8 mpg (US) ... 21.2 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 59.8 mpg (Imp)


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    If a Mirage owner's manual states 75W-80 GL-4 manual transmission oil, I would stick with that.

    I realize AMSOIL sells oil products, but they are also trying to help customers make a wise decision. This is what they say on this topic -

    "Whether you’re driving a sports car or an over-the-road truck, smooth shifts are important. The lubricant’s viscosity and friction properties play a vital role in shift quality. Viscosity that is too high could prevent shifting the gears until the transmission warms up or result in abnormally high temperatures during operation. Viscosity that is too low could cause the synchronizer and dog gear to engage too quickly, resulting in grinding or hard shifts and abnormal transmission wear. The wrong frictional properties will result in poor shift quality and possibly accelerated synchronizer wear."

    I don't mind saving a buck. When the oil company doesn't recommend their oil for our Mirage, that is a HUGE red flag for me. Check out the Redline site - https://www.redlineoil.com

    Check out Redline's 70W-75 GL-4 gear oil and type in our Mirage. You will get a red lightening bolt and a statement stating this oil is not recommended for my 2017 Mirage ES (manual).

    Now let takes this a step further - Check out their 75W-80 GL-4 gear oil and you will get the exact same warning!!!

    Redline is not recommending their products for the Mitsubishi Mirage. Given how many other cars are listed, I really doubt this is an oversight on their part.

    Oil companies want to sell their product to consumers. Yet, Redline is not recommending their manual transmission products for the Mirage.

    Given the small amount and infrequent intervals, I would stick with Mitsubishi's gear oil. It's one thing for a car company to only recommend their oil products. When an oil company doesn't recommend their product for our Mirage, I would take note of that. Unless I truly knew more than those creating/marketing these products, why would I even use Redline?
    Last edited by Mark; 12-01-2018 at 12:41 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eggman View Post
    This is interesting, Tim. How'd you find it? Do you think it's GL-4?

    Edit: Never mind - I see, following your link, that it is GL-4 and it is presented as a new product. Nice find.
    I was just poking around on Redline's site to see what they had available.



    Quote Originally Posted by Mark View Post
    Given the small amount and infrequent intervals, I would stick with Mitsubishi's gear oil. It's one thing for a car company to only recommend their oil products. When an oil company doesn't recommend their product for our Mirage, I would take note of that. Unless I truly knew more than those creating/marketing these products, why would I even use Redline?
    I agree with everything you've said. I am definitely not recommending that anyone do this. However, I may still give it a shot. I've worked as a mechanical designer at a gearbox manufacturer. I'm familiar with gearing and how oil is used and how it can cause failures. I am working to mitigate any possible damage as much as possible. I know there are risks and I think I am willing to take them. The worst case scenario is I grenade the transmission and have to replace it. I appreciate trying to talk sense into me though, haha.
    Custom Mirage products: Cruise control kit, Glove box light, MAF sensor housing, Rear sway bar, Upper grill block

    Current project: DIY Nitrous oxide setup for ~$100

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage DE 1.2 manual: 47.2 mpg (US) ... 20.1 km/L ... 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.7 mpg (Imp)


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    Quote Originally Posted by Daox View Post
    I agree with everything you've said. I am definitely not recommending that anyone do this. However, I may still give it a shot. I've worked as a mechanical designer at a gearbox manufacturer. I'm familiar with gearing and how oil is used and how it can cause failures. I am working to mitigate any possible damage as much as possible. I know there are risks and I think I am willing to take them. The worst case scenario is I grenade the transmission and have to replace it. I appreciate trying to talk sense into me though, haha.
    I just looked up what you discovered, because I was curious. Since 70W/75W isn't the recommended 75W-80 of our owner's manual, I wasn't shock when Redline didn't recommend it.

    It surprised me when Redline didn't recommend their 75W-80 GL-4 gear oil product, too!!!!

    I doubt you will blow up your transmission. Several are already using Redline products with no complaints.

    I question why an oil company is not recommending their product for our particular car? Is it a lack of faith in Mitsubishi products and not wanting to be liable? We are only speculating. Good luck with your experiment!

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    They probably dont have info on the mirage and frankly dont care enough to get the info. The amount of manual transmission equiped mirages out there are small.

    It meets and exceeds Mitsubishi specs. I've had it(the 75/80 mtl)in for 10k miles. No issues.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pryme View Post
    They probably dont have info on the mirage and frankly dont care enough to get the info. The amount of manual transmission equiped mirages out there are small.

    It meets and exceeds Mitsubishi specs. I've had it(the 75/80 mtl)in for 10k miles. No issues.
    I wouldn't make the assumption they don't care. They are in the business of selling aftermarket oils. Redline is not claiming this product is recommended for all manual transmissions requiring GL-4 gear oil, and they are very specific in which companies and vehicles they do list. The list of vehicles for each type of oil is quite extensive. I wouldn't assume this is an oversight on their part at all. Manuals may not be popular in the U.S., but we are not the norm.

    Look at their list of recommended vehicles. FIAT, Daewood, & other car companies I haven't even heard of are included. I have a hard time believing Mitsubishi not being listed is an oversight on their part. Especially when the Mirage is a car sold world-wide.

    I am convinced that Redline is an awesome product. I am not saying that it's not. If they sold a gear oil made for the Mirage, I would probably buy it. Their website seems to indicate they don't. I might add that Redline appears to be a company that does care. They asked you to list your vehicle to see if their products are compatible. If their product is not recommended for your car, they are quite clear about it. If they didn't care, they would just state this oil is good for any manual transmission requiring GL-4 oil. They don't do that!

    Redline has phone #'s, fax numbers, listed address, & email system set up. They seem to be a very up front company. Maybe it's a oversight on their part, & we could ask them about that. I'm just not inspired to buy from a company that tells me their product is not recommended for my car, nor would I recommend it to others.

    Redline may be the best manual transmission anyone could put in their Mirage. If that's the case, Redline should tell us that! Instead they are somewhat telling us, buy elsewhere.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark View Post
    I wouldn't make the assumption they don't care. They are in the business of selling aftermarket oils. Redline is not claiming this product is recommended for all manual transmissions requiring GL-4 gear oil, and they are very specific in which companies and vehicles they do list. The list of vehicles for each type of oil is quite extensive. I wouldn't assume this is an oversight on their part at all. Manuals may not be popular in the U.S., but we are not the norm.

    Look at their list of recommended vehicles. FIAT, Daewood, & other car companies I haven't even heard of are included. I have a hard time believing Mitsubishi not being listed is an oversight on their part. Especially when the Mirage is a car sold world-wide.

    I am convinced that Redline is an awesome product. I am not saying that it's not. If they sold a gear oil made for the Mirage, I would probably buy it. Their website seems to indicate they don't. I might add that Redline appears to be a company that does care. They asked you to list your vehicle to see if their products are compatible. If their product is not recommended for your car, they are quite clear about it. If they didn't care, they would just state this oil is good for any manual transmission requiring GL-4 oil. They don't do that!

    Redline has phone #'s, fax numbers, listed address, & email system set up. They seem to be a very up front company. Maybe it's a oversight on their part, & we could ask them about that. I'm just not inspired to buy from a company that tells me their product is not recommended for my car, nor would I recommend it to others.

    Redline may be the best manual transmission anyone could put in their Mirage. If that's the case, Redline should tell us that! Instead they are somewhat telling us, buy elsewhere.
    I know plenty of ppl on here run it and I've had it in for 10k miles now with no issues. Maybe someone can call or email them and ask.

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    I sure am interested in using it.

    The Redline 70W/75W is not that far off at 100℃ and flows much better at 40℃.

    I guess the question becomes what is the normal operating temperature of the Mirage F5MDB 5-speed manual transmission. I don't expect it is at the boiling point of water as the engine is. As Mark suggests, it may be too thin to provide sufficient protection against metal-to-metal contact. He has a point. It would be a fun experiment to put a temperature probe on the manual transaxle and record it's temperature at various operating parameters.





    Fun facts from Mitsubishi!

    For the FM5DB manual transaxle 1.7 qt (1.6 L) Mitsubishi specifies
    Mitsubishi Motors Genuine NEW MULTI GEAR OIL ECO API classification GL-4 SAE 75W-80

    The Warranty manual has different guidelines for the manual transaxle:
    Schedule 1 says replace the transaxle oil every two years or 30,000 miles ( or 48,000 kilometers), whichever comes first.
    Schedule 2 has no requirement for replacing the lubricant - only periodic checks for fluid level and condition.

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Mirage ES 1.2 manual: 49.8 mpg (US) ... 21.2 km/L ... 4.7 L/100 km ... 59.8 mpg (Imp)


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    I have had Redline MTL in my transmission for nearly 50,000 miles. No problems to report, and it smoothed out my shifting quite a bit.



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